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Dec 20 2012
By: Viddik Lombax Warrior 169 posts
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Blood in the Sand - A discussion on survivability and Patron mechanics

5 replies 94 views Edited Dec 20, 2012

I think it's fair to say health regen is an issue. At least in the 8 man (1 font for 8 players and located far from the battle) and to some degree with the 4 man FFA. Is it a huge deal? Perhaps not in some games, but when we are discussing things like kill streaks and are seeing mechanics and points rewarded towards them we have to start looking at this closely.

This topic is an off shoot of the -Blade of Athena- topic that I felt would do better if given its own attention and critiques. It's born off of my observations that we're seeing a massive influx of BoA users. hey are almost rivaling Hammer of Zeus users and eclipsed both Ares' and Zues' swords as well as the Barbarian Hammer.

 

'But Viddik' you cry out with eyes rolling, 'there will be many more weapons in the final product. Cookie Cutter builds are impossible to guess at this point!'

 

There will be, yes. However THIS ONE is the one that addresses survivability directly. It also forces us to look at the Patron gods and how mechanics tie into their patronage.

 

Looking over items, relics and not including passives we see three health regen abilities for Ares. Only two are equippable at a time. Say Chalice and Chest Relic (the parry one is so situational it is being excluded here).

Zeus has one heal (The Chalice) and FOUR Magic regen to choose from. One of which at rank 3 regens magic for -the entire team- per three chests opened.

 

If we are looking at the vitae of the very Patrons themselves it can be said Zeus' is magic and Ares' is health. Yet at the moment Zeus can regen magic much more efficiently then Ares can regen health. NOW couple in the BoA. Zeus players are now full blown support with a team HoT and Magic regen, all while unleashing massive AoE dmg. Ares players with a BoA is generally trying to keep their heads above water. In terms of each Patron's most valuable resource, Ares players will "run out of gas" faster.

 

i swear this isn't a Zeus nerf rant and I am aware there will be some tuning we'll see after the holiday. What I'm trying to show is -why- the BoA is quickly becoming the most commonly seen sword in the arenas. It offers one kind of Champion another tool to conquer and the other some validity.

 

Suggestion for possible solution -
I have not heard any dev specifically say health should be returned per kill. Perhaps it should be? Say with these values:
- A kill (weapon dmg, ring out, environmental, etc) returns 5 health.
- A Spell Kill returns 2 health.

- A Brutal Kill returns 10 health.
- An Ares Relic (lets call it the Relic of Subjugation) at rank 3 gives the player a 20% chance to regain 25 health on a Brutal kill.

 

This kind of solution does three things. It will allow players to branch out to other weapons without feeling like their survivability is being destroyed. It makes Ares players feel they are truely being rewarded by their patron (Zeus Relics definately make the player feel cleverness is rewarded) by acting in a bloodthirsty manner that would please him. It also allows for some really cool comeback moments in the thick of combat. No more lucky nic by a passerby killing you after you barely outplayed someone. You're rewarded (albeit minorly) for being the victor.

 

Opinions? tomatoes?

 

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Lombax Warrior
Registered: 12/14/2012
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Re: Blood in the Sand - A discussion on survivability and Patron mechanics

Dec 21, 2012
Did I lose readers with my rambling? <_< just throwing ideas out there that may be an improvement.
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Keyblade Wielder
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Re: Blood in the Sand - A discussion on survivability and Patron mechanics

Dec 21, 2012
I think the fountains were lazily done really. They don't have much detail to them and there's only 2 of them on team favor which can become hectic because after one battle you're ready for a heal.

Then again you don't want too many, because after you get hit like once a lot of people will be scrambling for the health rather than having to put up with it. I already get sick of people being able to just run away from my attacks to go to the health fountain.

I think it would be cool though, to have statues set up of a god...say since Zeus is magic based have a fountain you can step in where it looks like you're standing before zeus and gaining magic. For exp instead of breaking a chest (but still have chests for olympic treasures) have the character stand before an aries statue and gain exp and health via another god. Then again with exp that'd probably get more frustrating but it'd make sense with the others.

But a sword that heals is definitely going to be favored over a lot of other weapons, especially considering it has meh attack and insanely high defense. I'm sure it'll be more balanced if some of the kinks are worked out but currently I don't see it as OP but it definitely gives you a very large advantage in combat...but you have to remember it doesn't have any valuable specials. L1 + triangle doesn't knock back a lot, and doesn't launch and the L1+square can be parried.

You make a very good point about the class balanace with the BoA. But aries players are supposed to gain health with every kill well...I don't think it's every kill and when I switch over to zeus, he too gains the rare health gain from kills which I don't think is very fair. I believe zeus has an item that gives him health and magic? That seems pretty unfair too.

I'm not sure what the current balance is for the health per kill (or rare health or w/e it is) but it shouldn't be too much, and it shouldn't be too little. You don't want them to be considered a tank because of how much health they get, but definitely don't want aries players wishing they had a shot at killing zeus players.

Having more fountains would help a lot.
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Wastelander
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Re: Blood in the Sand - A discussion on survivability and Patron mechanics

Dec 21, 2012
*Ares
Erebus..jpg
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Keyblade Wielder
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Re: Blood in the Sand - A discussion on survivability and Patron mechanics

Dec 21, 2012

disturbeddude101 wrote:
*Ares

good input

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Blood in the Sand - A discussion on survivability and Patron mechanics

Dec 21, 2012
I don't want to say the fountains were done 'lazily' per se. It just feels like they were supposed to be complimented by another health source, hence my kill to heal reward chart. Granted I came up with the numbers but seems a no-brainer to me. Even with the Relic I thought up for Ares champions I doubt they could be considered 'Tanks'. An Ares champ will generally have less overall defense then other Champs - filling that berserker style play. That relic would actually encourage more aggressive Ares gearing and would compliment the god himself. You serve Ares by digging in, frenzied with bloodlust, he rewards you. This seems doubly fair given the Relic of Chance buff for Zeus players honestly.
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