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Lombax Warrior
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 5, 2012

Logical_Dolphin wrote:

Like I said before getting the digital rights is the biggest obsticle, because there are companies that existed during the PSone and PS2 eras, that no longer exist. Or in the case of a licenced property, the IP rights have expired or gone to a different company.

and i completey agree with that since it was my original point... the point in my last post was agreeing with you on that and stating why the rights were the biggest obstical

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Sackboy
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 5, 2012

Logical_Dolphin wrote:

The Emotion Engine has already been fully emulated in the CELL processor, as in the 80GB BC version of the PS3. The issue is emulating the PS2 GPU on the PS3,

Sorry, I still get confused on the proper names of PS2 thingies, as I completely skipped multiple console generations and PS3 is the first one I've owned since NES. I've heard people talk about the EE chip so much, that I assumed that was the name of the GPU chip on the partially BC units. But you are saying that that EE is not the GPU. Anyway I don't want to turn this into an argument of fine print where we go round and round trying to say which is the most difficult challenge when all of them are difficult. There are several challenges, and we seem to agree on that point. I personally don't see one as bigger than the other, since you can end up with several scenarios where rights can be bought but source code is long lost, or vice versa. All of those possibilities = unmovable barrier to posting as a PS2 classic.

If it was just a matter of rights even with bankrupt companies someone still owns them and if it was as simple as Sony contacting them and saying, "we want to offer you X% of money for every download of your product, all we need is you to sign the dotted line," who would turn that down?

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PIayStation MVP
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 6, 2012

In the PS2 the EE is the CPU, the PS2's GPU is called the Graphics Synthesizer or GS.

Since my knowledge on exactly how Sony translates PS2 classics is limited, I can only go by other examples (mainly what Microsoft has done). IMO emulating the CPU isn't the issue, but if the GPUs are too different, then there can be an issue with emulation. Microsoft accomplished this by establishing "Emulation Profiles" where they would custom make an emulator to suit a particular game engine, and usually it supports numerous games. Through this technique, Microsoft was able to get 51% of the original Xbox games to run.

I know there was at least one instance where a title from a bankedrupt company was brought to the PS store (Vangard Bandits), but I don't expect that to happen very often. IMO you should look to Vita and PS3 games to be available to download in a timely manner, since I am sure that the digital rights to those titles have already been secured...

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 6, 2012

if you think about it every code is on the disc of every game... they need the code to be read by the laser on the ps2 or ps3 bc version in order to play the game... so the only way to lose the source code is to make every disc that has the game data on it unreadable... and for the rights when a company goes bankrupt i believe you lose everything.... now some companies might save themselves from bankruptcy for a little bit buy selling things to get money to pay of what they own so they sell rights to places that want them meaning sony will have trouble getting them... now if im wrong about bankruptcy then what im saying is thrown out the window... and also some people will turn down money for rights... i know first hand especially if it was all i had left... your assumption of what they would do isnt completely accurate.... buying rights is a lot more difficult then you give it credit for

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VP of Gaming
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 6, 2012

Basch1990 wrote:

if you think about it every code is on the disc of every game... they need the code to be read by the laser on the ps2 or ps3 bc version in order to play the game... so the only way to lose the source code is to make every disc that has the game data on it unreadable... and for the rights when a company goes bankrupt i believe you lose everything.... now some companies might save themselves from bankruptcy for a little bit buy selling things to get money to pay of what they own so they sell rights to places that want them meaning sony will have trouble getting them... now if im wrong about bankruptcy then what im saying is thrown out the window... and also some people will turn down money for rights... i know first hand especially if it was all i had left... your assumption of what they would do isnt completely accurate.... buying rights is a lot more difficult then you give it credit for

A lot of times a bankruptcy court will have you sell off some assests. If a company disolves completely, sometimes the rights may fall into dispute, or they will be put up for sale by the creditors to try and recoup some of their money.

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Sackboy
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 7, 2012

Basch1990 wrote:

if you think about it every code is on the disc of every game... they need the code to be read by the laser on the ps2 or ps3 bc version in order to play the game... so the only way to lose the source code is to make every disc that has the game data on it unreadable... and for the rights when a company goes bankrupt i believe you lose everything.... now some companies might save themselves from bankruptcy for a little bit buy selling things to get money to pay of what they own so they sell rights to places that want them meaning sony will have trouble getting them... now if im wrong about bankruptcy then what im saying is thrown out the window... and also some people will turn down money for rights... i know first hand especially if it was all i had left... your assumption of what they would do isnt completely accurate.... buying rights is a lot more difficult then you give it credit for

Honestly dude, if you don't really know the difference between source code and compiled code, such that you think source code is contained on every PS2 disk, I'm just going to facepalm and give up trying to explain it. Carry on.

And let me describe bankruptcy more clearly because I've worked for a company that went through it. Bankruptcy means you owe money that you can't pay back. Usually that would be to a bank or investors. That means that when you declare you can't pay your debts, the debtors are in control and the courts are involved. Now replace the term debtors with "hungry sharks" that eat money, and you get the picture. Bankers aren't these altruists that would say, "Oh noes, we can't sell the rights to this game because it's all that is left of this company that owes us millions of dollars that they can't pay us back. We should hold on to this instead of recouping the little bit we can get back..." No, you are talking about the rights being held by people or investment firms whose ONLY currency is well, currency. And the courts could care less about your "property" when your property is the only way of satisfying your debt. Typically if the IP is actually worth anything competitors offer to buy it, and the bankers are happy to get dollars instead of crap that has paper value.

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 7, 2012

everything about the game is on the disc.... and i never said the bank wouldnt take it... i was saying the person could have a few of the rights left after selling the rest to pay off the banker and as sentimental value... you took everything i said out of context

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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 7, 2012

This is the only example that I know of where a game from a bankrupt company was published by a different company:

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/11/14/rare-psone-classic-vanguard-bandits-storms-psn-tomorrow/

So I have a feeling it won't happen too often...

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 7, 2012

yea but it still doesnt mean that sony won't have to jump through many hoops to get rights from bankrupt companies

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Sackboy
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Re: ADD THIS GAME TO PLAYSTATION 2 CLASSICS FOR DOWNLOAD

Mar 9, 2012

Logical_Dolphin wrote:

So I have a feeling it won't happen too often...

There was an important qualifier:

"Typically if the IP is actually worth anything competitors offer to buy it, and the bankers are happy to get dollars instead of crap that has paper value."

I'm not saying a competitor wants another's old game that's already been taken off the retail shelves because it's not selling anymore. I was talking about bankruptcy in general and perhaps strayed off on a tangent. Intellectual property that is deemed worth something, it is often bought by those who can make money off it. Sometimes that is a competitor, sometimes it's a company that makes money off of IP lawsuits. The central point I was making is that in bankruptcy, it's no longer yours, or your company's property.

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