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Treasure Hunter
Registered: 08/28/2002
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005

,
,
,trigun0006 wrote:
,
Just imagine the posibilities.  Games like counter-strike source which has up to 64 player online, now double that.  double it again.  and a 3rd time.  Awsome. 512 player death match.

,
,

like steppy said.. if it can render that much of data.. lol  but i think dynasty warriors game can be possible.. with real players,
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Fender Bender
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Malloc wrote:
,

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Malloc wrote:
,
From what I understand, this means that there will not be a single host per se, but rather the work of the dedicated server will be spread accross multiple ps3's (kind of like distributed computing).  My question is this: doesn't this mean that a) people with fast internet connections will benefit because other ps3's will help spread the data, and b) people with slower internet connections will suffer because they will be required to send more data then usual (i.e. instead of just sending the data once to the server, it will have to send the same data multiple times to multiple ps3's)?  Doesn't this go against the fact that download speeds are faster then upload speeds?  Obviously my question is flawed somewhere given that Sony is apparently implementing this type of network structure, I'm just trying to figure out what I am overlooking? Any ideas?

edit: I think I just stole snoogan's question, sorry about that.
,
,

Message Edited by Malloc on 06-09-2005 11:53 PM

,
,

,
it's a streaming data using socket, so my guess is that the data packet will be fix.  the problem is that we don't know how much data(or bandwidth) needed for online gaming.  128kb/sec? 256kb/sec? if it is 128kb/sec or 256kb/sec then it doesn't need to send that data to all the people on online. only upto 6 people. which is lot better than 16 people or more.

,
,
...but not as good as just sending data to just one person (the host).  Since servers are fast, they can afford to open a bunch of sockets opened at one time; however, people with slower internet connections would benefit from only having a single socket opened instead of 6.  Perhaps the number of sockets open at a given amount of time is dependent on the speed of the internet connection?
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,

Message Edited by Malloc on 06-10-2005 12:08 AM
,


,

,
i'm not sure, like Steppy said before. person can have lag because of their conneciton, but not due to number of players on online.  he says up to 6 people so maybe it can be lesser.  i don't know i guess if you have slow broadband then.. u r screwed? Smiley Tongue

,
,

It's not a matter that people "CAN" have lag because of their connection...it's a matter that EVERYONE has lag regardless of their connection.  It's inherent to how networks like the internet work.  Even if you have the fastest broadband available there is still lag.,
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Fender Bender
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,trigun0006 wrote:
,
Just imagine the posibilities.  Games like counter-strike source which has up to 64 player online, now double that.  double it again.  and a 3rd time.  Awsome. 512 player death match.

,
,

like steppy said.. if it can render that much of data.. lol  but i think dynasty warriors game can be possible.. with real players ,

,
,

Agreed, the best case scenario would be that any game could have the same number of players offline as online.  If a game can have 500 monsters offline and not stutter, you'd want it to be able to have 500 human controlled monsters and be just as playable.,
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Fender Bender
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005
that would be awesome
,
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Treasure Hunter
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005


Steppy76 wrote:

It's not a matter that people "CAN" have lag because of their connection...it's a matter that EVERYONE has lag regardless of their connection.  It's inherent to how networks like the internet work.  Even if you have the fastest broadband available there is still lag.





Technicly speaking there will always be lag in all cases, but as long as it's not noticable to the player, it shouldn't be an issue.
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Treasure Hunter
Registered: 08/28/2002
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005

,
,
,Steppy76 wrote:

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Malloc wrote:
,

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Malloc wrote:
,
From what I understand, this means that there will not be a single host per se, but rather the work of the dedicated server will be spread accross multiple ps3's (kind of like distributed computing).  My question is this: doesn't this mean that a) people with fast internet connections will benefit because other ps3's will help spread the data, and b) people with slower internet connections will suffer because they will be required to send more data then usual (i.e. instead of just sending the data once to the server, it will have to send the same data multiple times to multiple ps3's)?  Doesn't this go against the fact that download speeds are faster then upload speeds?  Obviously my question is flawed somewhere given that Sony is apparently implementing this type of network structure, I'm just trying to figure out what I am overlooking? Any ideas?

edit: I think I just stole snoogan's question, sorry about that.
,
,

Message Edited by Malloc on 06-09-2005 11:53 PM

,
,

,
it's a streaming data using socket, so my guess is that the data packet will be fix.  the problem is that we don't know how much data(or bandwidth) needed for online gaming.  128kb/sec? 256kb/sec? if it is 128kb/sec or 256kb/sec then it doesn't need to send that data to all the people on online. only upto 6 people. which is lot better than 16 people or more.

,
,
...but not as good as just sending data to just one person (the host).  Since servers are fast, they can afford to open a bunch of sockets opened at one time; however, people with slower internet connections would benefit from only having a single socket opened instead of 6.  Perhaps the number of sockets open at a given amount of time is dependent on the speed of the internet connection?
,
,

Message Edited by Malloc on 06-10-2005 12:08 AM
,


,

,
i'm not sure, like Steppy said before. person can have lag because of their conneciton, but not due to number of players on online.  he says up to 6 people so maybe it can be lesser.  i don't know i guess if you have slow broadband then.. u r screwed? Smiley Tongue

,
,

It's not a matter that people "CAN" have lag because of their connection...it's a matter that EVERYONE has lag regardless of their connection.  It's inherent to how networks like the internet work.  Even if you have the fastest broadband available there is still lag. ,

,
,
that is true if the bandwidth is not "fixed" number, which means if broadband connects to dialup user of course the broadband user is going to have lag. but if the bandwidth is fixed number for 56kb/sec needed to process some application then the application won't be getting any lag for broadband user.  am i right? stock exchange company executes 300k transactions per second.  and they don't tolerate lags. and they don't have lags. even a second is very important to them.
,
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Fender Bender
Registered: 04/11/2004
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Steppy76 wrote:

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Malloc wrote:
,

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Malloc wrote:
,
From what I understand, this means that there will not be a single host per se, but rather the work of the dedicated server will be spread accross multiple ps3's (kind of like distributed computing).  My question is this: doesn't this mean that a) people with fast internet connections will benefit because other ps3's will help spread the data, and b) people with slower internet connections will suffer because they will be required to send more data then usual (i.e. instead of just sending the data once to the server, it will have to send the same data multiple times to multiple ps3's)?  Doesn't this go against the fact that download speeds are faster then upload speeds?  Obviously my question is flawed somewhere given that Sony is apparently implementing this type of network structure, I'm just trying to figure out what I am overlooking? Any ideas?

edit: I think I just stole snoogan's question, sorry about that.
,
,

Message Edited by Malloc on 06-09-2005 11:53 PM

,
,

,
it's a streaming data using socket, so my guess is that the data packet will be fix.  the problem is that we don't know how much data(or bandwidth) needed for online gaming.  128kb/sec? 256kb/sec? if it is 128kb/sec or 256kb/sec then it doesn't need to send that data to all the people on online. only upto 6 people. which is lot better than 16 people or more.

,
,
...but not as good as just sending data to just one person (the host).  Since servers are fast, they can afford to open a bunch of sockets opened at one time; however, people with slower internet connections would benefit from only having a single socket opened instead of 6.  Perhaps the number of sockets open at a given amount of time is dependent on the speed of the internet connection?
,
,

Message Edited by Malloc on 06-10-2005 12:08 AM
,


,

,
i'm not sure, like Steppy said before. person can have lag because of their conneciton, but not due to number of players on online.  he says up to 6 people so maybe it can be lesser.  i don't know i guess if you have slow broadband then.. u r screwed? Smiley Tongue

,
,

It's not a matter that people "CAN" have lag because of their connection...it's a matter that EVERYONE has lag regardless of their connection.  It's inherent to how networks like the internet work.  Even if you have the fastest broadband available there is still lag. ,

,
,
that is true if the bandwidth is not "fixed" number, which means if broadband connects to dialup user of course the broadband user is going to have lag. but if the bandwidth is fixed number for 56kb/sec needed to process some application then the application won't be getting any lag for broadband user.  am i right? stock exchange company executes 300k transactions per second.  and they don't tolerate lags. and they don't have lags. even a second is very important to them.
,

,
,

No, you are not right.  It takes time for signals to travel the distance from one place to another...no matter if it's only a 1KB bandwidth requirement or 1TB bandwidth requirement.  There is lag on every single connection available to mankind.  ,
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Treasure Hunter
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005

,
,
,Steppy76 wrote:

,
 

No, you are not right.  It takes time for signals to travel the distance from one place to another...no matter if it's only a 1KB bandwidth requirement or 1TB bandwidth requirement.  There is lag on every single connection available to mankind.  ,

,
,

,
pretty much if you don't notice lag on online than there is no "lag" even though there is... right?
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Treasure Hunter
Registered: 02/04/2001
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005


Steppy76 wrote:

No, you are not right.  It takes time for signals to travel the distance from one place to another...no matter if it's only a 1KB bandwidth requirement or 1TB bandwidth requirement.  There is lag on every single connection available to mankind. 





Let me add that there is a force in the universe called entropy which in a nutshell is the gradual breakdown of matter. Since the signal that travels through a network is matter as well, breakdown of that signal (even as minute as it is) will slow it down. Like I said earlier, there is always lag whether it's great or small.
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Fender Bender
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Re: PS3 - Virtually Lag Free?

Jun 10, 2005

,
,
,snowcrash wrote:

,
,
,Steppy76 wrote:

,
 

No, you are not right.  It takes time for signals to travel the distance from one place to another...no matter if it's only a 1KB bandwidth requirement or 1TB bandwidth requirement.  There is lag on every single connection available to mankind.  ,

,
,

,
pretty much if you don't notice lag on online than there is no "lag" even though there is... right?

,
,

That is correct...though until we all have fiber optic connections in the home, there will be noticeable lag...the faster connections today still give you anywhere from 3 tenths of a second of lag to 7 tenths of a second of lag...and yes it is very noticeable compared to offline play.  You get "used" to it, but it still is quite noticeable.,
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